Chicago Tribune article about GTO

[cam00]

philyrossy, are you referring to the recent article by SANDRA WARD, consisting of 25 people? And, do you consider the "scam" with that group, or the "criminal groups" the article refers to. LOL

We've (myself and close neighbors) had all our tanks of gas stolen at night, some full of gas (about 5 or 6), not that long ago. Various neighbors have had their places broken into and EVERYTHING stolen. A few assault thefts have occurred on the nearby callejon. I don't know if the problems are escalating or not, but my landlady raised the height of our gates to about 20 feet, and had chain-link fences installed around the perimeter. As prices continue to move steadily, sometimes quickly, upwards, we can be guaranteed more criminal activity here in GTO.

[philyrossy]

I guess, then, that this article gives a very false impression of the real safety of Gto ? From your description, sounds about the same as at Lakeside, in Chapala, and SMA. :(

---

"are you referring to the recent article by SANDRA WARD, consisting of 25 people? And, do you consider the "scam" with that group, or the "criminal groups" the article refers to. LOL"

Yes, I was. I posted, as did others, to please tell us about the violence, etc. that they were referring to, and after our posts, NO ONE ever posted a reply or any other comments on that thread. I just assumed that silence meant they had no desire to post anymore about their program, as they did not have supporting info. Maybe violence is not supposed to be posted here, or referred to here, so if that is the case, please forgive me for bringing it up, as I am still new to this Board(but someone needs to tell me). But, if it occurs, and is ok to post, newer people would appreciate the info, as they can learn how to better prepare themselves, and the areas to try and avoid.
I never take violence or scams as laughing matters, but as serious threats to freedom. Thank you.

[admin]

Maybe violence is not supposed to be posted here, or referred to here, so if that is the case, please forgive me for bringing it up, as I am still new to this Board(but someone needs to tell me). But, if it occurs, and is ok to post, newer people would appreciate the info, as they can learn how to better prepare themselves, and the areas to try and avoid.
ADMIN NOTE There are no nor have there ever been restrictions on the subject or content of posts here on gtolist.

[cam00]

I haven't been attending to the list for awhile, which is why I hadn't commented on crime observed or reported here.

There ARE criminal SCAMS that occur here in GTO, where a couple or more people, especially around the time of CERVANTINO, will approach someone, usually rich-looking tourists/foreigners, and pretend to be helpful/friendly while picking pockets, or anything of value that can quickly and adeptly be removed. The predators may even "accidently" spill something on your clothes, and then "pretend" to help clean you up, while pick-pocketing you faster than a New York second. So, be very careful to be sure to carry any money or ID, credit cards, etc, in a wallet that suspends from a strong cord under your clothes and around your neck. Try not to bring any PURSES or day packs that can be easily CUT from your shoulders and that will never be seen again, unless completely emptied of valuables. Always carry a hi-powered taser that can reduce a full-grown man to his knees in a second, easily and legally bought on DOMINGO, at the embajadores (the guy also sells MANY leather belts). A resident is legally allowed to use this type of weapon in self-defense.

NEVER walk alone in the tunnels, unless you desire to try out your martial arts skills. I've heard of some pretty nasty assaults that have occurred in them. Certain areas are much more hazardous than others, like darkly lit alley-ways during the night and neighborhoods like Cerro de Quarto, I believe. Check with the tourist police for a list of areas to avoid even if travelling in a group.

Your residence should have hi-intensity motion-sensor lamps to secure ALL the perimeter. ALL windows and doors should have metal-work to help prevent intruders from gaining entry, and entry doors should be especially re-inforced to resist forced break-ins, with at least two high-quality locking mechanisms to better secure them. The property around the residence should have a fence at least 12 foot high, not easily scaleable (climbable).

The police will respond rapidly and forcefully if they see or hear a crime being committed, but AFTER the crime, they won't investigate, and won't even bother to look for the perpetraters, unless bodily harm has occurred. I doubt they're trained in detective work much.

There are groups of predators that prey especially on Gringo neighbor-hoods, and watch carefully the comings and goings of various gringos, to "case" a place. Then, when no one is at home, they force entry and steal as much as possible (up to a certain dollar amount), in the shortest time possible. They are purportedly very adept at these kinds of operations, making sure that no one will see them when they commit the crimes and also making sure they steal no more than a lower level criminal charge, like a misdemeanor, which would be leveled at them if caught.

In other words, they steal stuff worth up to maybe $5000 US and leave the rest. They will go for the small stuff 1st before anything else, so secure/hide any jewelry/watches, cell phones, digital cameras, or anything small and valuable. Do NOT put it under the mattress or in drawers or under the sofa cushions. Hide the stuff in something like the freezer, packaged to look like food, or in an empty cereal box, with the cereal in the bag placed ABOVE the stuff. Also, grand theft IS investigated much more seriously here, so they know that and avoid it.

Guanajuato is not a dangerous city, and the kinds of incidents I described are not frequent. But, one can do various things to protect oneself from possible violations, and I hope these suggestions and precautions are helpful.

[jesm]

Wow, how this innocent starting thread has gone wild. A brief newspaper article highly favorable to our city and we end up being advised to adopt police state measures to stay safe and protect property. The suggested cures are far worse than any potential disease based on my experience here. We consider this place very, very safe and live, move, and enjoy accordingly.

[cam00]

Calm down, take it easy, JESM. Any normal and rational person would want to take as many precautions as possible to protect themselves from a robbery or assault. That's merely prudent. All the criminal activities I listed in my prior post HAVE occurred here, and can be verified, unless one wants to remain an OSTRICH.

As prices have risen considerably, so too have these types of crime. Guanajuato, while way better than Los Angeles or many other places, is still NOT the Garden of Eden, unless you're a real estate agent from the states trying to garner a rapid buck off of gullible people. It does have crime, and the crime is rising, just go ask the police......if you want to be informed about reality.

[doncoulter]

A few points in response to cam00's recent posts:

1. Where do you get your information that Tasers can be "legally bought" in Mexico? From the guy you mentioned who sells them at the Embajadoras market? There's lots of illegal stuff on sale at Embajadoras (not "embajadores"), and the vendors are usually not your best source of legal information. According to Taser de M?xico, which ought to know, Tasers are restricted to police use in Mexico (www.taserdemexico.com/mexico/). The website says that apart from police use, both the sale and the importation of Tasers are illegal here.

2. Would you consider posting a photo of yourself? I prefer to give a wide berth to people who carry Tasers.

3. I don't know of a single residence in Guanajuato that meets your standards of what "your residence should have." Anyone who thinks he needs "hi-intensity motion-sensor lamps" and a 12-foot-high fence would probably be happier somewhere else.

4. Where are the "Gringo neighbor-hoods" you mention? I've lived here for thirteen years and I still haven't found any.

5. I suppose you will now tell me to "calm down, take it easy," as you recommended to jesm. I don't think it's jesm who has gone way over the top in response to the very minor crime we have here in Guanajuato.

6. There are several computer shops around town that could help you with that CapsLock problem.

Don

[cam00]

Don. Just petty. Really.

All valid, all true. Check it out yourself, if you care to.

All preventative measures, protection advice are the ones advised by professionals in the industry.

Police advised regarding taser use, the best kind of protection against an attacker/robber. Your responses were lame, Senior Don.

[doncoulter]

cam00:

"Just petty. Really" is not much of a response. In my own response to your post, I pointed out (1) that the sale of Tasers to civilians here is illegal, (2) that no residence I've ever seen in Guanajuato meets your security standards, and (3) that I've never found what you call a "Gringo neighbor-hood" here.

Now, do you prefer to respond with some actual evidence in support of your wild claims? Or do you just want to hit and run?

Don

[cam00]

Se?or Donny: That's all. Too bad if you don't like what I wrote. You're incorrect on a number of issues. and being petty.